Gods, Ghosts, demons.

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Gods, Ghosts, demons.

Postby Wolfie » Sun Mar 06, 2005 4:27 pm

Do any of us really know what lies beyond what we can see, touch, feel?
There have been stories of those who have seen ghosts, gods, demons. But is this really any different than a little girl and her imaginary friend?
The body. In a manner it's not the hardest thing to create. If you were to take pieces of a human and make your own Frankenstein would he live? Well, obviously not. But why? What makes a human a human? A dog a dog?
Well... All I've been able to come up with is the simplest answer you can find in nearly any religious book. The soul.
But what is the soul? Is it a special jump start that we haven't been able to figure out yet? Maybe.
But then... this brings us back to those wondering spirits, and those things we call gods when we reach near death, or the demon like creatures that haunt our dreams.
Spirits. So many cases of floating specters, orbs of light, strange noises, bumps sounds.
Are these simply things of our imagination caused by stress? Loss? Worry?
What about gods? Thousands upon thousands of people believe in gods, whether Kali, Zeus or your average Christian GOD. What makes a god a god?
There are many answers to that question. But... how do we explain the varying dreams of those who have spoken and conversed with gods?
Are these just more dreams created by our will to believe such? It isn't far from believable according to most physiologists.
Demons? Are they any different than gods? If so how?

So many questions that go unsolved.

Give your comments to my weird ramblings, eh?

Also, I'lll fix it later once I'm more awake. ^^" Oh, and I figure this is the right place to post? >>"
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Postby Roadkill » Mon Mar 07, 2005 12:14 am

i like to phrase it this way: Do we even know that there is something beyond seeing, touching, and feeling?

Many of the world's religions are based on the assumption of the afterlife -- and it's how many different civilizations, including today's, keep their people obedient.

Frankenstein and all that -- that's simple science. Life is a complex system of chemical reactions, once an organism dies, given enough time the reactoin system is too out of whack to fix.

Ghosts and spirits, i dunno. I heard a story from a former satanist, she had a wiccan friend who would summon spirits and do all the spiri stuff and it would scare the hell out of everyone. I wouldn't mind being to one of these summonings myself, but i dunno what it would do to my beleifs. Spirits don't prove Christianity. The only religion it proves is the "ancestor religions", where people pray to ancestors for guidance. Doesn't really stick with the idea that spirits stay with families. maybe that's because the beleif isn't comon in their mortality, so they don't what to do in immortality.

Stress, that is believable. some people ar ejsut prone to things -- they have disorders, and they don't become apparent until their pumped up. i mean it's like a balloon. flat it looks normal, but when you inflate it, it won't hold air -- theres a huge hole in it when you stretch it out. But their is reality -- where things physically happen. keep that in mind.

Muhammed, and Moses, and others who have spoken to god, apparently. I have no clue. Not stress, more like hope mixed with drunkenness. The salem witch trials -- theres a popular theory that the wells had a kind of natural drug from a plant of somekind. Anyway, thats why the girls were dancing and acting weird and thought they saw things. its not as far out as you think.

Gods -- thier fun, when there are more than one.
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Postby ChatOmbre » Mon Mar 07, 2005 12:37 am

Well, as far as visions and whatnot go... everyone I've known who have claimed to have visions was been smokin' somethin'. (Of course, you could always claim that maybe being drugged makes it easier to hear god or whatever.)
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Postby TerraFrost » Mon Mar 07, 2005 1:55 am

The body. In a manner it's not the hardest thing to create. If you were to take pieces of a human and make your own Frankenstein would he live? Well, obviously not. But why? What makes a human a human? A dog a dog?

trying to assemble a person without knowing how it really works is rather like plugging a bunch of circuit boards together and hoping windows xp will be able to install on it. ie. both are next to impossible with that lvl of knowledge. as our knowledge improves, it may be more do'able, but not right now, imho.

also, what's the difference between aibo - sony's mechanical dog - and a dog whose "soul" had been placed in a machine, as it were? is there a difference, or is the only behavorial difference in our heads? if there is a difference, is it all that difficult to imagine a time in which there wouldn't be a difference?
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Postby Drazo » Mon Mar 07, 2005 7:00 pm

If 'God' existed then why does he let so many suffer? Where was 'he' whenever I was in trouble? Then again, if I was 'him' I too would make others suffer but only to those who deserve to suffer. As for demons see below.

As for demons see above.

We are biological 'robots' but what makes ourselves (as in our mind) ourselves? (If you understand what I mean I salute you. ;))
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Postby Roadkill » Mon Mar 07, 2005 10:29 pm

That question is getting old, imo, Drazo. It's a very casual, and shallow response and reason to stay out of their religion, or to dislike/distrust it. While it is based off the Christian/Islamic idea that God is good, you apply the idea to mean that God is entirely well meaning to good people. Well, it depends on how you define good people.

Most seem to have adopted the idea that good people are huminitarians. However, are not those with an unwavering eye on the radical way to end so many of societies problems also a blessing? Hitler killed alot of jews -- but it brought God's first gospels back into the spotlight, and got the world so sympathetic that they gave them their homeland, and a foothold and reason for all jews to unite together.

So who are good people? Why should they not suffer the daily routine of life? Afterall, life is suffering. THe one goal, the one purpose of all life is to survive -- too keep itself running for as long as possible, no matter the torment. Life itself makes this planet more of a tremulous world -- without it, it would be so much more peaceful.

If God created life, then he also knew that all life must suffer, so that it may live.
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Postby TerraFrost » Tue Mar 08, 2005 1:19 am

That question is getting old, imo, Drazo.

that question has been getting old for several thousand years, atleast, heh. of course, despite that, religions for which that question poses a problem haven't disappeared, nor has it prevented smart and dumb people alike from becoming true believers of those religions. my own personal explanation for it is that pursuant to god's alleged omnipotence, he has the power to defy logic. (see this thread)

ultimately, i think belief in god is rather like believing that you, personally, do better on tests when you study the day before (as opposed to studying over the course of several days). neither belief is truely founded on reason. for the later to be founded in reason, you'd have to conduct a series of experiements, half of which involve taking tests after having studied for several days, and the other half of which involve taking the test after only one day of studying. then, you'd have to calculate a mean for both, a standard deviation, confidence interval, etc. people don't do that, and because they don't, it is a superstition, just as belief in god is. however, the fact that something is a superstition doesn't invalidate the possibility.
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Postby Drazo » Tue Mar 08, 2005 7:07 pm

That question is getting old, imo, Drazo.


Which question?
[spoiler]Actually, all three of them are (pretty much) rhetorical questions, especially the second one. :p[/spoiler]
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Postby TerraFrost » Tue Mar 08, 2005 9:45 pm

Which question?

the first two, i believe.
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Postby Rapscallion » Thu Mar 10, 2005 2:48 am

i have faith in religion bcause it gives me hope, think of demons as the unholy, and respect the dead who deserve respect. that's about it.
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