thoughts on fahrenheight 9/11

Trippy discussions of moral issues, conspiracy theories, the paranormal and other otherworldly phenomenon.

Moderator: Dracofrost

thoughts on fahrenheight 9/11

Postby TerraFrost » Thu Feb 17, 2005 6:33 am

something that occured to me just now... in the last few scenes of fahrenheit 9/11, michael moore asks members of congress to enlist their kids in the army. he criticized them because they didn't want to sacrifice their child and then says that the poor step up so we don't have to.

however, doesn't he just sorta contradict himself, there? congressmen's children undoubtedly don't *want* to go to iraq, whereas those in the army presumably *did* want to enlist. congressmen shouldn't force their kids to enlist nor should impovrished parents bar their kids from enlisting. so why are the congressmen the ones being criticized?
TerraFrost
Legendary Guard
 
Posts: 12357
Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2002 6:37 am

Postby tsian » Thu Feb 17, 2005 9:32 am

however, doesn't he just sorta contradict himself, there? congressmen's children undoubtedly don't *want* to go to iraq, whereas those in the army presumably *did* want to enlist. congressmen shouldn't force their kids to enlist nor should impovrished parents bar their kids from enlisting. so why are the congressmen the ones being criticized?


No, not at all in fact. The arguement he attempts to present is that we've created an economic system where the poor see little option or choice but to enlist. Also, due to the poors living condition, they make the perfect target for enlistment campaigns. Furthermore, Moore is attempting to illustrate / argue the point that if Congressmen are willing to sacrifice lives for a cause they 'believe in', then shouldn't they be willing to see their children serve?

I'm not trying to support or prove Moore's arguement. It has problems, to be sure. However, I don't think his actions are contradictory to his goal.
Vive le titre de deux.
In an ironic twist, the only trait I find completely appaling is intolerance.
User avatar
tsian
Castle Guard
 
Posts: 683
Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2003 4:19 am
Location: BC, Canada

Postby TerraFrost » Tue Feb 22, 2005 9:58 am

Furthermore, Moore is attempting to illustrate / argue the point that if Congressmen are willing to sacrifice lives for a cause they 'believe in', then shouldn't they be willing to see their children serve?

the thing is, congressman are only, as of now, sacrificing willing lives. whether or not these lives were made willing through illicit means is another matter, although personally, i don't believe they were. personally, i think that the reason that impoverished people are more willing to serve is merely a consequence of income inequality.
TerraFrost
Legendary Guard
 
Posts: 12357
Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2002 6:37 am

Postby tsian » Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:57 am

the thing is, congressman are only, as of now, sacrificing willing lives


As you say, Moore argues that socioeconomic conditions may mean a lot of soldiers don't exactly choose the career. Furthermore, his point is/seems to be that as protectors of all citizens, congresswoman should not value a soldier's life any less than one of her daughters.

Also, note, that these people are 'willing' to be in the army... they do not get to pick/choose the wars they wish to fight
Vive le titre de deux.
In an ironic twist, the only trait I find completely appaling is intolerance.
User avatar
tsian
Castle Guard
 
Posts: 683
Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2003 4:19 am
Location: BC, Canada

Postby Evlfrost » Wed Feb 23, 2005 3:53 pm

Also, note, that these people are 'willing' to be in the army... they do not get to pick/choose the wars they wish to fight


And never have and never will until the end of time. They knew when they signed up that they might have to go somewhere they don't wish or fight for some reason they don't agree with.
Evljsh: You're young and thus illegal!
xXOkashiiSuruXx: -falls over-

Image
User avatar
Evlfrost
Frost Druid
Frost Druid
 
Posts: 6692
Joined: Thu Dec 05, 2002 2:41 pm
Location: Suburbia

Postby Exalted Ugu » Thu Feb 24, 2005 6:34 am

"And never have and never will until the end of time. They knew when they signed up that they might have to go somewhere they don't wish or fight for some reason they don't agree with."

And yet, they probably did not realize that their terms of service could be extended possibly indefinitely. And since millitary recruiters do not generally play up the soul-shattering horror of actual war, they are signing up for something entirely different to the reality of the situation they actually face.

Ask any ten soldiers in Iraq now weather they're 'willing' participants.

-ugu
Exalted Ugu
Townfolk
 
Posts: 102
Joined: Sun Sep 07, 2003 11:18 pm


Return to Twilight Zone

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron